Agenda and draft minutes

Hackney Carriage/Private Hire Joint Working Group
Tuesday 13th December, 2016 10.00 am

Venue: Southport Town Hall

Contact: Mark Toohey  Tele: 0151 934 2274

No. Item


Apologies for Absence


Paul McLaughlin


Minutes pdf icon PDF 80 KB

Minutes of the meeting held on *


Agreed as a true record


Matters Arising from the Minutes


RJ 154 re reps. JM 148 guide dogs.


Enforcement pdf icon PDF 63 KB

Statistics attached.


RJ mentioned the decreasing number of faults found on inspection. MT confirmed this has been the trend.TC asked if door signs need to ne on PH vehicles? MT confirmed, when working, door signs need to be on but can be removed when the driver is not working. AC asked about plate exemptions and MD travel. MF said they operate under an ‘O’ licence and are outside the scope of the licensing regime.




1.    DBS checks currently cost £5 per check to process and has been paid by the Council. Proposal is to pass this cost on therefore raising the cost of a DBS from £44 to £49.


2.    Other charges in the OSS. Currently some services are not chargeable but require resources to process (such as vehicle transfers). It is intended to add a charge to the list of fees for these processes


3.    11% rise is due next April



MT explained that DBS checks need to be raised by £5 to cover the costs. RJ suggested publication of a newsletter. MT also mentioned new fees for plate transfers etc. as these are currently carried out for free but take up 10% of the OSS’s time. 11% rise will be going ahead as planned in April 2017.



L & R Reports

1.    Fees

2.    Immigration Act

3.    Tariff increase


Immigration Act checks for all drivers. PH explained process for passports/birth certificates if copies required. General discussion on the new requirements followed. RJ raised S77 English speaking requirements for public bodies.



Ongoing workstreams

1.    Merseyside officer group progress

2.    Testing station review


MT gave a brief update on the ongoing work of the joint Merseyside authorities. Some items to resolve include tyres (inc part worns), spare wheels and window tints. Officers hope to have reviewed most documents by January.


Testing stations – TJ asked to be removed from any working group. TJ also queried the ‘don’t buy the Sun’ campaign and vehicle wrap. MT explained that the campaign does not breach conditions or ASA rules so was allowed. TJ unhappy with this and would like it raised at the spokespersons meeting


Vehicle plates

Chair to update group on proposed changes to vehicle plates


MT updated the group on the proposed new plates which will be in use around February time.


VRQ Content

Item raised by Richard Jarman.


Checks on VRQ content: PHV drivers have no idea a cab does not need an operator’s licence; neither trade realise an authority cannot refuse to issue a PHV vehicle licence; the adequacy of taught material must be monitored – mechanisms to ensure this to be explored.



General discussion around VRQ content and if/how it could be amended. RJ suggested speaking to Tony Norbury. RJ/MT to explore.


Knowledge Test

Item raised by Richard Jarman.


The testing of applicants should now include an oral appreciation of the trade; topography and comprehension.


RJ said any changes should include oral comprehension test. Group discussed drivers who do not know the area. AH asked if the test should go 20 miles north of Sefton as it goes 20 miles south? TJ said it should be HC only and PH has all the technology it needs. MT said he was considering a test on handbook and conditions. AC said the tests take it much longer for new drivers to get a licence. MT said it was time to reconsider post Deregulation Act. AC said it was unfair.


MT said it’s format can be discussed at the spokespersons meeting. TC said Leyland has no KT and there is no discernible difference between qualities of driver’s knowledge.


NM explained the Uber rating system. Feedback from Sefton & Knowsley is no different despite the lack of a test in Knowsley.



TQP Update pdf icon PDF 61 KB



RJ said its time to speak to politicians about its work, Agreed to put it as an agenda item on the spokespersons meeting.



Equality Act pdf icon PDF 39 KB

Item raised by Richard Jarman – see attached.


MT will contact all members if any further information is received about implementation.



Trade Group Membership

Item raised by Richard Jarman.


Discuss the criteria for having trade reps that do not participate; those not contributing should not have an effect on governance?


MT said a review of the constitution was long overdue. MT to send out the constitution for further discussion.


Date of next meeting *



14 March 2017 at Bootle Town Hall.


Any Other Business

In accordance with Minute No. 37 (iii) of the meeting of the Licensing and Regulatory Committee of 24 February 2003, other business may only be considered if agreed by the Chair and a majority of the trade and if it is of an urgent nature. i.e. requires consideration prior to the next scheduled meeting of the Hackney Carriage and Private Hire Joint Trade Working Group.



AC raised inequality of Knowsley v Sefton in relation to the knowledge test. AC mentioned the case of a driver who owes the company £675. AH raised advertising. MT to liaise with trading standards.